Left In Lowell

Military Weapons in Lowell??

7 Responses to “Military Weapons in Lowell??”

1. Art is Fun Says:
   June 15th, 2009 at 3:28 pm

   Lynne, A topic of interest, I’d like to make a few points if I may. I don’t want to start a pro or anti firearms discussion, my interest is on the use of spin and buzzwords to get people excited about subjects in which they may not be expert.

   1. An M14 is 7.62mm weapon it uses a Nato cartridge which is no different from a US 30 cal, one of the most popular hunting cartridges.

   2. The main difference between a “military” grade weapon and one you can buy at Wallmart is the ability of the weapon to take a beating and still function as intended. eg. a 9mm Taurus pistol can do the same an HK 9mm. The Taurus will cost $300-400 while the HK will cost $1200-1500. the Taurus will wear out while the HK will be firing after being run over by a tank and spending a week in mud.

   3. Now if the guns the city has can fire in full auto mode, this is a whole other situation.
   If they are semi-auto than they are not much different than an ordinary hunting rifle except that it will still fire after you run over it with the cruiser.

   Here are two Wikipedia links if anyone would like more info.

   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M14_rifle

   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7.62_mm_caliber

2. tryin to stay anonymous Says:
   June 15th, 2009 at 6:55 pm

   I’d say its logical that Lowell received the 4th biggest amount since it is one of the larger law enforcement agencies in the commonwealth. I highly doubt these are issued weapons for patrol officers. I imagine they are locked in the armory for use only when needed likely by SWAT trained personnel. Only officers who have qualified at the firing range to use the weapons would use them. There are also many ex-military personnel in the police department who are quite familiar with how to operate a military grade weapon.

   We don’t want to think a Columbine or LA bank shootout can happen here, but better to be prepared than caught outgunned. I read the Globe piece and I’m not sure Salem State needed these weapons, but Virginia Tech probably didn’t either, right?. If law enforcement can’t have these weapons then no one should, but the gun genie has been out of the bottle in this country since its inception, its tough to go back now. How can you tell the people on the side of enforcing law and order they can’t have what is otherwise available. Besides, a bullet can kill you just as dead regardless of the weapon that fires it.

3. Corey Says:
   June 15th, 2009 at 10:36 pm

   I remember many years ago, reading an article in The Sun that the LPD was upgrading the standard firearm for cops (if I recall the specifics correctly) from a .38 to .45 - the reasoning being they were being outgunned on the streets.

   While I can’t remember the last time a shootout happened in Lowell at all, never mind one with fully automatic weapons, if you read the paper you know that it isn’t uncommon for guns up to and including AK-47s (a fully automatic assault weapon) to be found during even routine traffic stops.

   Seems that there are quite a few very powerful and highly illegal weapons floating around in the hands of Lowell’s gang members, and just like you don’t show up with a knife to a gunfight, a SWAT team doesn’t show up to a house where military weapons are likely present with standard issue police gear.

4. Mimi Says:
   June 16th, 2009 at 6:09 am

   Rob Mills’ writes on his Police Blog in the Sun that “Lowell Police have had semi-automatic AR-15 rifles deployed in the cruisers of trained officers for about a decade now” and ” that about six officers per shift carry these weapons [AR-15] in their cruisers, but they can only do so after getting extensive training on this particular rifle. They also have to remain certified on it. All officers on the force are trained to have a basic knowledge of the AR-15 in case they need to pick it up in a critical incident, but only those with more extensive training are allowed to carry and use the weapon.”

5. Paul@01852 Says:
   June 16th, 2009 at 6:31 am

   There have been comments here and elsewhere re: Columbine and VTech, both horrendous events. But will someone please explain to me how law enforcement armed with military weapons could have changed either situation even in a minor way? And I realize its not Lowell but how can any law enforcement department justify grenade launchers, 2 of which are possessed by the West Springfield police?

   The only justification for the carrying of rifles by any branch of law enforcement would be during the deployment of a SWAT team potentially requiring snipers. The official SWAT team for the Merrimack Valley is NEMLEC (Northeast Massachusetts Law Enforcement Council). NEMLEC is not listed as having obtained any of these weapons from the military surplus program.

   The best news is the state Dept. of Public Safety has suspended this program per the order of the Governor until a detailed study is completed.

6. Corey Says:
   June 16th, 2009 at 8:27 am

   Paul - according to Richard Howe’s blog, the M79s are intended for use with tear gas. Again, the question of who exactly has access to these things and under what training is a good one, but I’m not opposed to officers carrying something like this, especially because as far as I know, tear gas is nonlethal. As for the only use of a rifle being in a SWAT situation with snipers, the Lowell Police Blog points out at a standoff I believe on Christian Hill last month, they deployed one of the AR-15s because the guy was in the house and potentially dangerous, and you’re not going to want to try to shoot someone that far away with a handgun if he sticks a rifle out the window. Isn’t that valid? The concern with a high-powered rifle bullet is always there that if you miss, the bullet doesn’t stop for X feet, where X can be in the thousands - long way in Lowell. These are hard questions that should be asked.

   In general though, what is the primary concern? That “collateral damage” will happen, that it could lead to police oppression? The cost and general inappropriateness? Or is it just that we weren’t told and have no idea who is training these people on these weapons?

7. Paul@01852 Says:
   June 16th, 2009 at 10:30 am

   According to Bob Mills/Lowell Sun blog NONE of the military semi-automatic weapons have been used nor are they deployed in cruisers in Lowell. According to Mills approximately 6 AR-15’s (not M-14’s) are deployed per shift by officers with “extensive training” and who are “certified.” These are the weapons that were used on Christian Hill. So now I have two questions: (1) If the Lowell Police already had AR-15s why did they also obtain M-14s? Just because they could? (And by the way, how much did these unused M-14s cost?)(2) If they only use the AR-15s what do they plan to do with the 25 M-14s?

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